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Importance Level

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Author	Message
Mark	Posted: May 20, 2008 I get the feeling that I must be missing something obvious, but... How are Importance Levels set? This seems to be something that Toodledo decides to create based upon rules unknown to me. I have looked for how or where to set this, like I would set priority levels. Currently I have a handful of tasks added and Importance Level 5 and 2 show up.
Toodledo	Posted: May 20, 2008 Importance is defined by a relatively simple equation. We had been keeping it as a trade-secret, but since it can be reversed engineered pretty easily, we might as well disclose it here: Importance = 2+P+S+D P=priority S=is it starred (0 or 1) D=0 if due-date is non-existent or further than 14 days out, 1 if due-date is between 7 and 14 days out, 2 if due-date is between 2 and 7 days out, 3 if due-date is tomorrow, 5 if due-date is today, and 6 if overdue
Qrystal	Posted: May 21, 2008 Ahhhh, that explains why I hadn't seen Importance = 12 until after the star feature was implemented. Verrrry cool! I'm impressed at how powerful it is for so deceptively simple an equation! Thank you, I'm so thrilled that you shared it! (I'm one of those "numbers-people" :P) (OH: and a chronic procrastinator.) -Qrystal This message was edited May 21, 2008.
vegheadjones	Posted: May 21, 2008 Have you thought about adding status? Next Action should have a higher importance than merely active.
Toodledo	Posted: May 21, 2008 We had not thought about including status, but that is a good idea.
MikeDidIt	Posted: Jun 03, 2008 Posted by Toodledo: We had not thought about including status, but that is a good idea. I agree that adding status to the mix is a good idea.
quicknik	Posted: Jul 28, 2008 Okay, listen. This "importance level" feature is a nuisance. By second guessing the user, and concealing the logic behind its calculation, the concept is a bit infantilizing. Let ME decide what the importance level of something is. It's also an example of project-management thinking forcefully applied to something that might very well be as simple as buying eggs and milk. It's over-thinking the otherwise straightforward, and the overwrought sophistication makes me want to run away from your product. At least let the user disengage that feature. For me, the stars and priority are plenty.
Toodledo	Posted: Jul 28, 2008 You are welcome to ignore the importance feature and rely on priority and stars. All you need to do is not pick "importance" as a sort option. If you are interested in knowing how the logic works, the calculation for importance is listed above. Hope that helps.
yt8019	Posted: Jul 28, 2008 OK this thing has been bugging me too but just worked out how to turn it off -- you need to click on Sort then pick something other than Importance. The sort option will stay that way. It's an innovative idea maybe I'll come back to it some day. This message was edited Jul 28, 2008.
Qrystal	Posted: Jul 29, 2008 Maybe the "infantilizing" aspect of this would be reduced if the Priority setting was given more weight in the formula. Perhaps just replacing "2+P" in the formula by "2^(1+P)" would help. In other words: Importance = 2^(1+Priority) + (1 if Starred) + (Due Date modifier) With this change: Priority -1 results in a +1 to Importance (since 2^0 = 1) Priority 0 results in a +2 to Importance (since 2^1 = 2) Priority 1 results in a +4 to Importance (since 2^2 = 4) Priority 2 results in a +8 to Importance (since 2^3 = 8) Priority 3 results in a +16 to Importance (since 2^4 = 16) Thus, something of Top Priority (3) is immediately escalated to the top of the Importance list, no matter what. Something of High Priority (2) can't compete with something of Top Priority, because the highest Importance score a High-Priority task can get is 8+6+1 = 15, and that's only if it is seriously Overdue and Starred. Because it is so easy to tweak Priority settings, they really should be able to have much more power than they currently do, because they can be so helpful in determining what should be done next! I, personally, like the Importance scale and find it really useful even as it is, but I have occasionally wished I could have a bit more control over it. A scheme like I've described above might be just the thing that's needed! Another thought is to leave Starred out of the formula. If the Star's main purpose is to give us a way to look at a list containing only the Starred items, there's no real need to change the Importance rating because all items in that list will be changed by the same amount. This message was edited Jul 29, 2008.
Toodledo	Posted: Jul 29, 2008 A task that is due today is more important (because it must be done today) than a higher priority task that does not have a due-date (because you can do it whenever). This is why we have make the importance calculation give slightly higher weight to due-date. That said, there might be an opportunity to have different formulas for importance that people could choose in their account settings. We'll think about this.
gsimonizer	Posted: Jul 30, 2008 I haven't found many flaws in this product, but this is one of them. The Importance level is arbitrarily defined, no matter how much "logic" the developers insist is behind the algorithm. No matter how much deep thought and rationale lies behind the algorithm, it won't fit everyone's idea of what is "most important" because we all use priorities, stars, and due dates a little bit differently. Bottom line: importance is subjective. It can never be distilled down to a single equation. I wish life were that easy. Since this is easy to ignore, it doesn't affect how I use the product or my positive experiences with it. I put this feature in the category of "nice try". This message was edited Jul 30, 2008.
gsimonizer	Posted: Jul 30, 2008 Let me give an example where the algorithm for Importance breaks down. Many of my due dates are more like target dates, with some flexibility built in. I like to mow the lawn once a week, but if for some reason I'm out of town or can't do it for some reason, it's okay if it waits a few more days. Paying taxes, on the other hand, absolutely must happen by April 15. Yet, if I was behind on my lawn mowing around tax time, there would be many scenarios where "Mow Lawn" would appear higher in Importance than "Pay Taxes". Little silly isn't it?
Toodledo	Posted: Jul 30, 2008 You are correct. Toodledo cannot read your mind (yet), nor can it understand natural language and make judgements based upon the name of the task (yet). So, it has to make do with a rough calculation. We know that this will not work for everyone, and that it will not always be 100% accurate, which is why people will need to use some common sense when deciding what to work on the next.
vegheadjones	Posted: Jul 30, 2008 Great response! I agree that common sense will always trump algorithms. In fact, as many of you must know, David Allen (The GTD guy) recommends not using priorities at all and instead you should rely on your judgment at the moment on which actionable task you should do next. That being said, I do use priorities and I also use the Importance algorithm, as it is a nice way to get an "objective" view on what I should be working on first. However, I also use the status to create "Next Actions" which, when I sort by status first and then importance causes next actions to be separate, allowing me to apply common sense to the importance list and force some items to "appear" more important than the algorithm suggests. So Toodledo, where upthread I recommended incorporating Next Action into the Importance algorithm--I humbly withdraw that suggestion :)
Qrystal	Posted: Jul 31, 2008 Posted by Toodledo: A task that is due today is more important (because it must be done today) than a higher priority task that does not have a due-date (because you can do it whenever). This is why we have make the importance calculation give slightly higher weight to due-date. So, let's say I have a task due today such as mowing the lawn, but I also have a task that can technically be done whenever, such as submitting my application for a Business License, but that I consider very important and thus High Priority. The current Importance calculation essentially requires me to give it an artificial due date in order to keep the Importance ranking sane. That's not so bad, of course, because the artificial deadlines do keep me on my toes. However, it is disheartening to so often see things Overdue, and to have to keep tweaking those artificial deadlines. I've considered using the ?-modifier, but the tasks aren't exactly optional, it's just that the due date is flexible. Perhaps, then, the problem is as I was describing elsewhere in these forums: just that there isn't a way to distinguish between actual "hard" due dates, and artificial or "soft" due dates. I'm not sure what to suggest for that though, or else I would be suggesting it! :)
jimherald	Posted: Jul 31, 2008 Different formulas are an option. Another way to implement would be a sort of adhoc formula. Give users access to their relevant variables (priority, starred, due, or whatever) and they can add, subtract, multiply in whatever fashion they want. But it's probably a little overly complex for a To Do list. The items on the list are what we are supposed to be working on in GTD. Not the list itself. :)

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