ForumsNewsToodledo Update August 2019


Toodledo Update August 2019
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c5000nc

Posted: Dec 03, 2019
Score: 2 Reference
I've been in touch with Anant via email in the last few days, and he said they are working on rolling out a big update. He said once it is done, he will post an update in the forums. He said it is taking a lot of time (my guess is far more than expected) to prepare test cases, and then check each and every functionality of Toodledo, for every test case. It sounds very laborious. I'll take deliberate, thorough and slow over rushed any day, if the end result is a better product.

As Anant told me several months ago, they got stuck because the 7 year old code-base had just been patched up over the years. They are spending their time preparing a stable update before implementing new features. Like I said before, it sounds like it's taking far longer than expected to clean up what his predecessors should have done before he was hired.

I for one am still appreciative of Anant, who is actually working to improve ToodleDo every day, even if it's taking far longer than expected, and even though he does a poor job of keeping us updated.

Though I still create backup csv and xml files regularly (which I would do with RTM and others too), I'm sticking with ToodleDo at least a few more years, because nothing else suits my needs as well, and because someone is trying to stabilize and improve it. Albeit very slowly.
jzamoras

Posted: Dec 03, 2019
Score: 2 Reference
there is no way I will renew my sub unless there are noticeable improvements and much more reasonable price point.
CJD

Posted: Dec 03, 2019
Score: 2 Reference
Thank you for the update. I am a long long Toodledo customer, and I am sticking by as well.
I have tried so many, and tired of trying.
Toodledo isn't perfect but I know it like the back of my hand.
Thanks, wishing for the best.
creinhard

Posted: Dec 03, 2019
Score: 0 Reference
Thanks for the Update c5000nc

Chris
J O D

Posted: Dec 04, 2019
Score: 2 Reference
Although I am using a different tool now, I have invested on Stack Social for a single year, just for fun (and good memories), so I am watching these forums from a distance. Should there actually be any update (and until I see it, I will not believe there will be any), then I will be reevaluating my coming back. But I will not trust Toodledo with my productive life anymore without conditions - I had been deeply disappointed by the "team" beyond frustration and trust once lost simply cannot be regained that easily.
oletros

Posted: Dec 05, 2019
Score: 1 Reference
Posted by c5000nc:
I've been in touch with Anant via email in the last few days, and he said they are working on rolling out a big update. He said once it is done, he will post an update in the forums. He said it is taking a lot of time (my guess is far more than expected) to prepare test cases, and then check each and every functionality of Toodledo, for every test case. It sounds very laborious. I'll take deliberate, thorough and slow over rushed any day, if the end result is a better product.

As Anant told me several months ago, they got stuck because the 7 year old code-base had just been patched up over the years. They are spending their time preparing a stable update before implementing new features. Like I said before, it sounds like it's taking far longer than expected to clean up what his predecessors should have done before he was hired.

I for one am still appreciative of Anant, who is actually working to improve ToodleDo every day, even if it's taking far longer than expected, and even though he does a poor job of keeping us updated.

Though I still create backup csv and xml files regularly (which I would do with RTM and others too), I'm sticking with ToodleDo at least a few more years, because nothing else suits my needs as well, and because someone is trying to stabilize and improve it. Albeit very slowly.


Yap, the same thing he has been saying since last year.

Fool me once ...

And the mobile apps development is dead.
c5000nc

Posted: Dec 05, 2019
Score: 1 Reference
I would agree about mobile app development being dead for now, until he finishes cleaning up what should have been cleaned up 5 years ago. I use Android and love Ultimate To Do List for it, so that is not an issue for me.

I would guess 1,000s of tests are involved to run a long list of test cases run through every functionality of TD, given how feature-rich it is. But the end result, even if a year or two after when we think it should be done, will result in a far more stable product that will probably be much easier to improve.

I'm sure it is taking drastically longer to do it right than anyone would have thought earlier this year. Maybe that's why the previous owner bolted so unexpectedly. It turned out to require countless hours of grunt work. To Anant's credit, he stuck around, and is doing the laborious grunt work others before him should have done.
greginfla

Posted: Dec 05, 2019
Score: 1 Reference
but he should be sharing updates...... get out with news/updates even if it just we are here and working..... the silence is killing them. I wish they would just drop/stop the app development. fix the core system. we can use the mobile version of the website until then.
c5000nc

Posted: Dec 05, 2019
Score: 0 Reference
I told him he just needed to tell everyone what he told me. Not sure why he isn't.

He pretty much said mobile app development is stopped until the core system is fixed. But it is actively being fixed.
pawelkaleta

Posted: Dec 06, 2019
Score: 1 Reference
Posted by c5000nc:
He pretty much said mobile app development is stopped until the core system is fixed. But it is actively being fixed.


You sound as you have actually seen the code Anant "is working on", you had a chance to see the progress on your eyes etc. and you basically sound as totally convinced that the old code base was so bad it takes now so much time to "fix" it. Have you seen any "proofs" for this? Or you base only on the anouncements of new owners on the forum and on the hell-I've-got-no-idea-why private and not publicically anounced updates exchanges via e-mail? I'm not trying to offend you, I'm just trying to understand what made you believe so much in what Anant is saying? Have you noticed the new owners have been doing neverending-talking-only since they took TD? Are you sure you aren't just simply being fooled a little bit longer than others?
pawelkaleta

Posted: Dec 06, 2019
Score: 1 Reference
Posted by Anant G. on 2019-08-29:
I will try to make everything transparent on what we are working on may be weekly basis.

Today: 2019-12-06 (14 weeks later, no single update posted, only 4 (four) not important posts on the forum since then)


This message was edited Dec 06, 2019.
Ummagumma

Posted: Dec 09, 2019
Score: 2 Reference
Well, let's summarize what we do know.

The new owners posted their Roadmap in the early November of last year.

It included, among other things, a new mobile app. Which may have not been a big deal for some people, but a huge one for me.

Now, we are into the 2nd year of their redesign effort.

No new functionality has been added (no major one, anyway), some features have been taken away. The development of mobile app (a must in 2019) is dead, for now at least.

While I still used Toodledo web, it worked fine - for the most part. The biggest problem I had was that it would sometimes randomly decide to revive deleted tasks. Which, the last I checked, it still does. While the code re-write is probably needed, it does not yet benefit any existing user.

So, when - and if - this code rehash project is finally done, the users will be left with a somewhat reduced list of the same features they had before, working the same they worked before. Only after this happens, they can expect to see any improvements or added features built using the new code. Of course, new code = new bugs.

With the glacial pace of this project so far, and the high user attrition rate, and the fact that Toodledo is now one of the most expensive task managers on the market yet wouldn't look too appealing to anyone not already heavily vested in the service, the future does not look good at all.

Given all that, the lack of frequent updates from Toodledo team is a very bad sign. And it hurts them by creating even more fear and uncertainty and making things look really bad.


This message was edited Dec 09, 2019.
KBC1-Gold-Active

Posted: Dec 09, 2019
Score: 2 Reference
There are a lot of messages over the past six months that some users have probably not read. Here is a quick summary of my thoughts.

Remember to do frequent backups in both XML and CSV. You can always read your lists using Excel and the CSV file. If the ToodleDo server goes down, can upload your XML file to RTM (Remember the Milk) and see most of what you have in your TD files. Maybe not all of the notes.

I was happy with ToodleDo a few years ago. I do not need any feature updates or changes. Just maintenance to keep it current with standards and continue running as it has been running. The Web app has everything I need to keep doing what I have been doing for ten years. The mobile App works fine on both my iPhone and my iPads (I have several). Perhaps I am not as demanding as some of the others in this forum.

I have a Gold subscription that is good for another 9 months or so. And I bought that so-called "life" subscription that was offered earlier this year. I occasionally backup my Gold subscription and upload it into the lifetime subscription, that I hope will work for another 5 years or so.

There is a lot of repetitious complaining in this forum, people saying the same thing over and over. I agree with much of what is being said by the users. But some folks seem to have unreasonable expectations. This is a very inexpensive SaaS app, and you cannot expect the world. I doubt that Jake made much money while he was running it, and the new owners were probably surprised with how much work there was for little revenue. Typical for the software business.

All of our complaining does not do much to solve the problems we face as a group. Look back over some of the messages from this year, and see if you can offer any solutions. OR... suggest somewhere we can all migrate together. Maybe RTM? Maybe somewhere else? I will be happy if a server is running somewhere where I can read and access and update my TD xml files via desktop and iPhone / iPad. I am not expecting perfection.

By the way, has anyone been in contact with Jake? He's the one who could resolve all of this.

Thanks...


This message was edited Dec 09, 2019.
KBC1-Gold-Active

Posted: Dec 09, 2019
Score: 0 Reference
The other forum (on Slack) is still running as of today. It should continue to work for awhile if the ToodleDo server goes down.
There is some good information there and a few suggestions that might be useful to some users. Start by reading the first messages posted in September.

Paste all of the URL below into your browser all of the way to the end including ZDRkYWU

https://join.slack.com/t/td-user-coop/shared_invite/enQtNzg4MDIzNTYwNDgyLWU4MzJhOGJmZDU1MTIzMzFlYTBi MTk4ZDFiYWNhNTEwOWUyMjY0M2JmNzhjODA1YzU5Y2Y0NGJiMjgwZDRkYWU


This message was edited Dec 09, 2019.
KBC1-Gold-Active

Posted: Dec 09, 2019
Score: 0 Reference
In reference to the September 12, 2019 discussion here:
https://app.slack.com/client/TMXDDR9M0/CNCD2SRSA/thread/CNCD2SRSA-1573443313.026300

-------------------------------------------------------------

Has anyone spoken with Sam, Ramon, Anant or anyone else about some of the users on _this_ forum acquiring the current ToodleDo source code (possibly PinkJava?) and installing it on a SaaS server somewhere to assure that we can continue using it if they decide to shut down the current ToodleDo.com server?

Maybe a group effort / shareware / open source / arrangement could maintain it and keep it running for awhile (without any significant changes)?

???


This message was edited Dec 09, 2019.
oletros

Posted: Dec 09, 2019
Score: 0 Reference
Posted by c5000nc:


He pretty much said mobile app development is stopped until the core system is fixed. But it is actively being fixed.


Updated
June 5, 2018

Really actively fixed

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.kiwlm.mytoodle
Ummagumma

Posted: Dec 09, 2019
Score: 2 Reference
Posted by KBC1-Gold-Active:
But some folks seem to have unreasonable expectations. This is a very inexpensive SaaS app, and you cannot expect the world.

...

All of our complaining does not do much to solve the problems we face as a group.

...

Thanks...


I am afraid you are missing the point.

It doesn't matter whether it's an expensive or inexpensive app in the grand scheme of things.

What matters is that it's more expensive than most SaaS apps in the same category (Todoist, RTM, TickTick etc) while not having even close to the same name recognition and user base as the segment leaders.

And in the eyes of potential new users, Toodledo also has to compete with free offerings from MS, Apple and Google.

Given the extra price, the lack of name recognition, the lack of an up to date mobile client, it is going to be pretty hard to attract lots of new users.

So the question is, how long can the service keep afloat on the shoulders of existing users, many of whom seem to be leaving in droves ?

Asking this is not complaining.

The biggest problem with Toodledo was not the old code. The biggest problem - from the marketing perspective - was the lack of name recognition, an outdated and complicated interface that is not well suited to someone with simple task management needs, and a mobile app that is the opposite of being a joy to use. None of which has been addressed.

Raising prices to rewrite the old code on a fairly obscure product without making it any more appealing was a major mistake and so far there seems to be no willingness to correct it.
oletros

Posted: Dec 09, 2019
Score: 1 Reference
Posted by Ummagumma:
Posted by KBC1-Gold-Active:
But some folks seem to have unreasonable expectations. This is a very inexpensive SaaS app, and you cannot expect the world.

...

All of our complaining does not do much to solve the problems we face as a group.

...

Thanks...


I am afraid you are missing the point.

It doesn't matter whether it's an expensive or inexpensive app in the grand scheme of things.

What matters is that it's more expensive than most SaaS apps in the same category (Todoist, RTM, TickTick etc) while not having even close to the same name recognition and user base as the segment leaders.

And in the eyes of potential new users, Toodledo also has to compete with free offerings from MS, Apple and Google.

Given the extra price, the lack of name recognition, the lack of an up to date mobile client, it is going to be pretty hard to attract lots of new users.

So the question is, how long can the service keep afloat on the shoulders of existing users, many of whom seem to be leaving in droves ?

Asking this is not complaining.

The biggest problem with Toodledo was not the old code. The biggest problem - from the marketing perspective - was the lack of name recognition, an outdated and complicated interface that is not well suited to someone with simple task management needs, and a mobile app that is the opposite of being a joy to use. None of which has been addressed.

Raising prices to rewrite the old code on a fairly obscure product without making it any more appealing was a major mistake and so far there seems to be no willingness to correct it.


Exactly this.

One thing I have noticed is that Toodledo is praised for being the most feature rich, but this is not important. It is an app with a very high price compared with the others, with an oudated interface, hard to use and witth a mobile app without push sync and with a look from years ago, at least the Android app.

And in almost a year and a half after a lot of promises, almost no feature has been developed. The few ones with a lot of problems.

I don't see a bright future
shelbyp

Posted: Dec 10, 2019
Score: 2 Reference
I have decided to move to TickTick. I looked at Todoist and RTM quite a bit and was disappointed that I don't see much recent development (for RTM). Todoist recently had a major release, but many of the reviews for the Todoist App and the website are negative following the changes that were made.

TickTick has most of the TD features and some that TD doesn't have (better calendar support, zapier support). Also the Zapier integration is comple and allows basically integration with any app. One thing that I like about ticktick is that it is obviously being actively developed:
https://ticktick.com/public/changelog/en.html

I am really concerned hat Toodledo has gone to minimal support. And I question even if support will be given if the system goes down. There is almost no feedback in the Forums from TD, all questions are answered by other users. The only questions which TD currently answers are those for users requesting support on how to complete a payment!

I have made a backup of my stuff and am migrating to ticktick.
Notes have been moved to Office360 (OneNote online).
tasks and outlines have moved to ticktick (ticktick as no real outline support, but I use taks, subtasks and the note in the tasks to simulate my outlines. Actually the main missing feature forme in all other systems is the outlines which I find really powerful in TD (fast, easy intuitive, and many shortcut keys). I don't think other task managers have this, and I find it really useful to have tasks/outlines in the same tool.

Ticktick interface is different and needs some getting used to, but this will be the same with any system.

I would advise people to make backups of there stuff, the amount of feedback we are geting from TD is extremely concerning. I am way too dependent on my task management to be able to risk it on Toodledo.

Unfortunate since TD is more than sufficient for my needs and I have been here for 10+ years, but this is becoming way to risky.


This message was edited Dec 10, 2019.
jzamoras

Posted: Dec 10, 2019
Score: 0 Reference
Posted by shelbyp:
I have decided to move to TickTick. I looked at Todoist and RTM quite a bit and was disappointed that I don't see much recent development (for RTM). Todoist recently had a major release, but many of the reviews for the Todoist App and the website are negative following the changes that were made.

TickTick has most of the TD features and some that TD doesn't have (better calendar support, zapier support). Also the Zapier integration is comple and allows basically integration with any app. One thing that I like about ticktick is that it is obviously being actively developed:
https://ticktick.com/public/changelog/en.html

I am really concerned hat Toodledo has gone to minimal support. And I question even if support will be given if the system goes down. There is almost no feedback in the Forums from TD, all questions are answered by other users. The only questions which TD currently answers are those for users requesting support on how to complete a payment!

I have made a backup of my stuff and am migrating to ticktick.
Notes have been moved to Office360 (OneNote online).
tasks and outlines have moved to ticktick (ticktick as no real outline support, but I use taks, subtasks and the note in the tasks to simulate my outlines. Actually the main missing feature forme in all other systems is the outlines which I find really powerful in TD (fast, easy intuitive, and many shortcut keys). I don't think other task managers have this, and I find it really useful to have tasks/outlines in the same tool.

Ticktick interface is different and needs some getting used to, but this will be the same with any system.

I would advise people to make backups of there stuff, the amount of feedback we are geting from TD is extremely concerning. I am way too dependent on my task management to be able to risk it on Toodledo.

Unfortunate since TD is more than sufficient for my needs and I have been here for 10+ years, but this is becoming way to risky.


great! are you in paid sub? how subtasks work? can you add repeating reminders? thx!
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