ForumsNewsFuture Plans
Future Plans
| Author | Message |
|---|---|
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sumanah |
Current users:
https://www.toodledo.com/tools/import_export.php has the backup and export tools, https://www.toodledo.com/info/privacy.php is the current privacy policy, https://www.toodledo.com/info/news.php is the blog/news page. It is incredibly natural and healthy to feel a lot of fear when we hear about changes affecting systems we depend on and have nearly no control over. It's like finding out your landlord sold the apartment building to another landlord. New owners: Hi. I'm a paying user. A few questions for you: * The current privacy policy says, "We may share aggregated information with our partners. This is not linked to any personally identifiable information." Do you plan to add any new partners with whom you will share our data? Who are the current partners? * The current privacy policy says, "This website is run by a company based in the USA and all of the data stored by this website is stored in the USA." Will that continue to be the case? * Could we learn a little about Anant? * Jake said, "Starting next week, we will begin the transition and start talking about their plans for the future." Could you commit to posting an update here when you have a more specific timeline for the transition? * Are any people on your team people who have any of the following characteristics? Desktop Linux users, people currently using Toodledo for their daily task tracking, people who use an email provider/interface OTHER than GMail, Android phone users, people who use two-factor auth on lots of services, people who frequently work offline for multi-hour stretches, women. * Could you perhaps set up a live office hour or conference call where current paying users could speak with you synchronously, over chat or voice? (I presume that you will not publicly share details such as how much you are paying for the site and codebase, current operating costs, whether you plan on this being a fulltime job for the 3 buyers, and so on. If you want to surprise me, I'd love to know these things too!) |
|
creinhard |
I am a longtime Gold Subscription User and I find this news disturbing. I filled out the survey, but its brevity and generic nature give me an uneasy feeling.
To Sam, Ramon, Anant, – can you tell us which to-do list manager you guys are using? And if you are using ToodleDo, how long have you been using it, and which features do you like? At the risk of being extorted, I will tell you I would pay for more (than Gold Subscription) to keep ToodleDo the way it is. Chris |
|
Purveyor |
Perhaps the new owners will change the name from Toodledo to ToodleDo, given that many users think that's the name ...
In any case, I’ll just wait and see what happens. For now, Toodledo does the job for me but, if there are major changes that I don't like, there are plenty of other options. |
|
ramonvanmeer |
Posted by wwmalone:
In what country do the owners reside? In what country are the computer files, data etc maintained? We all live in San Francisco area and everything in the backend will stay the same, Jake use Rackspace for his server and that stay exactly the same. |
|
boydston01 |
Posted by ba66e77:
There are other tools that have prettier UI's but nothing I've found has the flexibility and power of Toodledo. Toodledo lets me bend it to match my process rather than forcing me to bend to match its process like all the prettier tools do. Well said! This message was edited Jul 10, 2018. |
|
SquidgyFishy |
Posted by Purveyor:
Perhaps the new owners will change the name from Toodledo to ToodleDo, given that many users think that's the name ... In any case, I’ll just wait and see what happens. For now, Toodledo does the job for me but, if there are major changes that I don't like, there are plenty of other options. I'm so guilty of calling it ToodleDo.... I have no idea why I do that! |
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mjbernstein |
7 pages into it--the new owners having purchased the site utilized by all these people with OCD and shaking their heads asking themselves "What have we gotten into?"
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Uly |
First off, big thanks to Jake. First for making and running a task manager that I've used and enjoyed for years, and second for finding someone to take it over when he was tired of it. As much as people are trepidatious about it being sold, it's so much better than just letting it die.
As far as the new owners go, what makes me nervous about them is that their strength seems to be building up an app until it can be sold profitably to a large company. So even if they treat Toodledo with care, it seems obvious that there'll be another change of ownership in the next few years, this time to a large company who, whatever they do with it, won't keep Toodledo as a stand-alone product. ...Uly |
|
aleding |
Re-posting the LinkedIn and interview links:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/ramon-van-meer-a19a01144/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/parrsam/ Ramon interview on cheddar.com SoapHub - one of Ramon's media sites This message was edited Jul 10, 2018. |
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Jim_11 |
Another long time paying sub; I really appreciate all Jake has done.
I'd like to see api improvements so we can get integration with drafts5. While I've looked and tried other apps, most recently todoist (since its got better drafts integration) I am still w/toodledo since it does what I want, how I want... -jim |
|
aleding |
I held off as long as I could but I gotta push back a bit...
There is absolutely no proof supporting the statements that having both the legacy and "new" iterations is not possible nor a bad idea. Of course it's possible - software companies literally do this every single day via different versions, major releases, etc. So let's please understand - this is definitely doable. Yeah, I know - it's cost...but that is also fairly easily mitigated (not eliminated - mitigated) by using a common code base as much as possible, increasing the paid subscriber base, and possibly (though not really desired) paid support. Given the app's apparently good design coupled with it's extensibility, I think the common base is likely going to happen. As to more subs - I'm talking about maybe adding a tier that would be like what the free is now and make the free plan more pared down. Finally, paid support - not ideal but definitely an option - at least for a while. And if these guys do go after more enterprise and succeed, then the revenue will eventually be able to probably enable free support for most non-enterprise users. This evolutionary model is not unheard of - Apple did this with several of their apps and OS revs. Glass half-full folks and yes, while still being a realist... This message was edited Jul 10, 2018. |
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GSP1963 |
@aleding: Can you name one software app currently out there that has an older version of code from years past that's up and available to users as well as an actively-developed version? Kudos if you can; I'm an IT veteran and I can't think of one. And if you can't? Perhaps you need to reconsider your statement, "There is absolutely no proof supporting the statements that having both the legacy and 'new' iterations is not possible nor a bad idea."
This message was edited Jul 10, 2018. |
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Purveyor |
@GSP1963,
Take a look at Todo by Appigo. Available since the App Store was launched in 2008. It's how I found out about Toodledo. (See iPhone App.) Still available. Requires iOS 7.1 or later. Last updated Sept 30, 2015. Current version is Todo Cloud (last updated June 5, 2018). Similar but with more features, and does not sync with Toodledo. Regardless, I do agree with your basic premise. Edited: Sorry, one more example: I have an Office 365 subscription, with Office 2013 on one computer and Office 2016 on another. I originally installed 2016 on both but I had to remove it from one computer because of incompatibility with an older version of Exchange Server, and I was able to download and install the 2013 version. This message was edited Jul 10, 2018. |
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GSP1963 |
@Purveyor: Thanks; I appreciate the information. I've used Appigo's Todo in the past, but hadn't heard of Todo Cloud until you mentioned it here.
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Jim_Lewis |
@aleding
Something I haven't seen mentioned much in this thread is that Slack, Hipchat, Teams, are the real future danger.... Some people say, "I use ToodleDo for my business. We depend on it. Can't change anything...." Yet the reality is really hip users are moving to stuff like Slack as these more modern apps offer a lot of collaborative/"productivity" tools that are integrated or integrate with their product, including planners/schedulers/etc. So the danger for ToodleDo, not much discussed here, is that real businesses of more than one or two people move on to these more organizational/collaboratively tuned apps that offer the necessary useful level of planning/task management built-in and folks with a team to work with don't find the same level of functionality in ToodleDo. An example of a high-level of functionality in such products that ToodleDo lacks (AFAIK). You are a team working around something like Slack or Teams. You have a business arrangement with another company. You need to collaborate. What do you do? In Slack and MS Teams, you can have guests and share info and tasks as needed. Where are guests in ToodleDo? So I think ToodleDo's new owners need to keep their OCD "old" users happy but still keep their eye on how the most useful planners for many will be those that integrate well with collaborative tools like Slack et al. on into the future. Although a web search shows that Zapier can be used to integrate ToodleDo with Slack, actually searching the Slack app directory for ToDo apps that integrate with Slack shows ToodleDo nowhere in sight.... https://slack.com/apps/search?q=todo So those who say, "Don't change ToodleDo one iota," are behind the times and are pronouncing its death sentence. https://get.slack.help/hc/en-us/articles/224766507-To-do-lists-in-Slack- |
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aleding |
@GSP1963: Yeah - pick any mainstream app or OS running today. Do you think they kill the current version when the new one is released? Of course not - that would be incredibly shortsighted and lame which is why it's not done. In terms of active dev and being available...again, different versions - For example, MS-Office for both Mac and Windows...
And, come on man - the "I'm an IT vet" card? OK, while I really hate to use my resume to justify my assertions, I too am an "IT vet" - been doing this since 1988 - all walks including app dev, LAN sysadmin (started w/ NetWare), BRAS support & dev engineer, WAN network infrastructure engineer, CMTS\DOCSIS software engineering at Cisco for 7+ years, etc...the list goes on. So while I really don't think any of that is relevant to this (or most) thread, let's just agree we both profess to know a thing... This message was edited Jul 10, 2018. |
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aleding |
@Jim_Lewis: Everything you mentioned is basically what I summarized in a previous post as "...more focussed on enterprise..." and without knowing the new folks goals and intentions, everything is open to speculation.
So those who say, "Don't change ToodleDo one iota," are behind the times and are pronouncing its death sentence. This simply isn't a forgone conclusion. Could it be? Of course. Must it be? Of course not. Is it likely? Again, it comes down to what the new owners' goals are. And I don't really think people truly mean don't change it one iota - I think they don't want to lose something that they have found to be incredibly beneficial to their workflow. This story has been played literally dozens if not hundreds of times before: app exists - many users are happy...this leads to acquisition and promises to do no harm and to only "improve" on the good - i.e. to the "next level" (never a more amorphous term has there been)...app changes dramatically and old users are left out in the cold. I didn't write this story but I've certainly seen it a few times...it just is what it is. And strangely, far too many people think that change is universally a good thing but in reality, it's not. Change is good only when change is required and if users are happy with the app in it's current state, then from their perspective, it does not require change. People expressing that sentiment aren't necessarily behind the times - they just want to protect something valuable to them. But all that said, I do agree re: a push into enterprise. I do think the new guys are looking to make some dinero by hitting an underserved market with a highly malleable application leveraging GTD+...esque methodology with collaboration\mobility being key. And I think they saw Toodledo as a springboard to launch from due to it's maturity, flexibility, and design. Why build new when you have this killer platform already out there that can be modified in some pretty compelling ways...AND it's been field tested for a decade plus!!! Makes sense to me if I'm thinking like I believe they are... This message was edited Jul 10, 2018. |
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nimax |
I have used this app for years and like it the way it is. It concerns me that major changes aren’t planned “yet”.
This is like classic Coke. Please don’t screw it up by making it like all the other To Do list apps. I tried a number of them and like this one the best. I think I should start shopping for a backup app for when the major changes arrive. |
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GSP1963 |
aleding wrote: And, come on man - the "I'm an IT vet" card?
I wasn't playing a card, nor did I intend to offend you. What I was trying to communicate is that I've been in IT a long time and what you seem to be suggesting the new owners do--create two versions of a product--is rarely done. We aren't talking about operating systems here, we're talking about apps. Nor are we talking about a megacorporation like Microsoft, which has hundreds of millions of dollars and hundreds of developers at their disposal. We're talking about three or four guys who just bought Toodledo. Aside from Purveyor's excellent example of Todo and Todo Cloud, I just don't know of any apps similar to Toodledo where the owners have chosen to split the app and send it down different paths. If you think the new owners of Toodledo ought to do that and might do that, fine. I don't think they should, nor do I think they will. We'll have to agree to disagree here. This message was edited Jul 10, 2018. |
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Jim_Lewis |
@aleding
I think the problem with your analysis is in cause/effect/correlation and disregard of how relative business size/success factors into any maintenance of multiple versions. You are attributing the demise of apps to changes after the sale. I would say it's the (failure to change/adequately satisfy a need and) sale that leads to the demise most of the time. The actual changes made by any new owners may just be symptomatic of and correlated with the problems the app is suffering with its would-be user base. And perhaps the usual case is just the new owners no matter what can't pull the irons out of the fire. On the old app vs. the new app versions, let's not mix apples and oranges, either, in two regards. First, the existence of old app versions of Office is largely for PHYSICAL "boxed product" versions of Office. Once sold, in the good old days, it was out the door as a disc. You couldn't bring it back or force your users to upgrade. But you still needed to keep them happy and secure. Now we're on to web-based products where you can force your users to upgrade. Microsoft does not maintain multiple versions of Office 365 or Windows these days unless you pay them a lot extra to be on a long-term enterprise plan for Windows, etc. They realize the drag maintaining old versions is on their business and would like to force all users into a Office-as-a-service, Windows-as-a-service business model where they only have ~one version to develop/keep secure, etc, and give you at most something like an 18-month window before you have to move on. Secondly, very, very large businesses like Microsoft can afford multiple versions to some degree because there's a suitable many-to-one relationship between customers and company programmers but ToodleDo very likely does not have the customer base to support the maintenance of multiple versions (remember: it got sold for a reason). They say companies die because they get set in their ways and can't adapt to new business circumstances. Maybe companies also die because their customers get set in their ways, too, and won't give the companies the latitude to adjust to changing business circumstances, e.g. the folks who wanted to buy horseshoes down to the last blacksmith.... We are in very different economic times from the "good ol' days" and it takes a different business model to survive. Just ask Microsoft. |
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